Bizarre Dream of the Anti-Christ

:o

Tell the old lady, if you ever do, that she has done good...ish

Now we know who the Anti-Christ is! Or a possible candinate!

Who knows, now if you don't mind, I'm going to vote for the new anti-christ. Toodles

Actually, I got some info on him from Wikipedia

Barack Obama, born August 4, 1961, in Honolulu, Hawaii, U.S. Senator from Illinois. A "draft Obama" movement began with his well-received 2004 Democratic National Convention keynote address. Obama was the featured speaker at Iowa Senator Tom Harkin's annual steak fry, a political event favored by presidential hopefuls in the lead-up to the Iowa caucus. He was endorsed by talk show host Oprah Winfrey in 2006.[79] Various recent opinion polls have seen Obama trailing only Hillary Clinton in several polls.[80] If elected, he would become the first African-American President of the United States. Obama announced on February 10, 2007, that he will run in 2008. He has filed the official paperwork.[81] Obama placed first in the January 3, 2008 caucus in Iowa, followed by Edwards, Clinton, and Richardson.

WOW Spring,

Thats quite a dream you had. I'm not sure what to make of it. I haven't paid much attention to the debates because I've been for Kucinich since the last election. I did see something on the news the other night about Barack's wife, evidently she is quite convincing herself. The stuff about Oprah blows me away. I never watch her anymore since she stopped doing spiritually-based shows. I would be interested in hearing what others think of this.

:coffee4: OK, here goes:

I interpret dreams in a Jungian manner. He claims a dream is prophetic (probably) if it occurs in one place, personal when it occurs in three (or more) distinct cases. In this dream, two crowd scenes, one space/time flight continuum.

When it is personal, all characters in dream are parts (different aspects) of the dreamer. In this dream there was the current dreamer (her present age(I assume), the elderly her, and the Oprah Winfrey her. The Obama character was not present, but was talked about.

The symbols were biblical, all of them. (there are other christ-christlike concepts throughout the world (Krishna, for example among hindus).

Is the dreamer struggling with her euro/white/judeo-christian/eastern/black,yellow,red african viewpoints about the end times? Does the dreamer believe "the judeo-christian end times scenario" as portrayed by her when she is elderly will simply float away into the time-space continuum with her, one way or another?

Important is to know WHAT was left out, what the dreamer would have said, had the elderly woman been silent, and most important of all, how the dreamer felt when she awoke.

This is clearly the three aspects of woman: maiden,mother, and crone.
Is there hope or despair as a result? (three scene dreams in the Jungian way is the what, where it may lead, and how to get there/resolve the dilemma of the first scene (How to be heard in front of a crowd).

I hope this helps.

(p.s.) I had a person recently who spoke strongly about herself, a born-again Christian being told in a dream that Bush was the anti-christ. She believed the message came from god.......

Its all in our own belief constructs. If the dream was prophetic for all of us, it wouldn't have had riddles to solve, change of place, leaving the listener "hanging in space".

SM, your post says you are online. Want to chat? I am in chatbox scratching to find some morsels....

I have to make it perfectly clear I am not endorsing one candidate one way or the other, and I most definitely never believed Bush to be the Anti-Christ, and I really don't believe it will be Obama either. I have always felt he would come from the east - far east, and would not be of caucasian or black ethnicity. To tell you the truth I feel the anti-Christ may even be a political concept or ideology as in the "beast."

I don't know what this dream is trying to relay to me, but it struck me as very bizarre. I usually don't dream of politics. Most of my dreams are cryptic, as I stated, but this one was clear and the message kind of threw me. The part about the middle name just blew me away because I had never given it any thought whatsoever. When I looked it up I was floored. Hussein of all things. Who would have guessed? Now I am going to look for the middle names of all the candidates to see what they are. This piqued my curiosity.

It probably is personal, and I think I have been reading too much nonsense. However I have not paid any attention to Oprah in years. I do not even know what she has been up to lately other than I did see that she came out and endorsed Obama, but I had this dream before she came on the scene.

What these two individuals in this dream mean to me personally I have not quite figured out. I have not really been following the political process closely, so for me to dream this was startling.

I hesitated to post this because I definitely did not intend on sending a political message or mean to endorse or debase one candidate one way or the other.

I don't think anyone took it that way Spring.

:bump:

Wild Dove wrote:

I interpret dreams in a Jungian manner. He claims a dream is prophetic (probably) if it occurs in one place, personal when it occurs in three (or more) distinct cases. In this dream, two crowd scenes, one space/time flight continuum.

When it is personal, all characters in dream are parts (different aspects) of the dreamer. In this dream there was the current dreamer (her present age(I assume), the elderly her, and the Oprah Winfrey her. The Obama character was not present, but was talked about.

The symbols were biblical, all of them. (there are other christ-christlike concepts throughout the world (Krishna, for example among hindus).

Is the dreamer struggling with her euro/white/judeo-christian/eastern/black,yellow,red african viewpoints about the end times? Does the dreamer believe "the judeo-christian end times scenario" as portrayed by her when she is elderly will simply float away into the time-space continuum with her, one way or another?

Important is to know WHAT was left out, what the dreamer would have said, had the elderly woman been silent, and most important of all, how the dreamer felt when she awoke.

This is clearly the three aspects of woman: maiden,mother, and crone.
Is there hope or despair as a result?

I think Willy is on to something there.

Also, I'd like to add that for those of us who visit other message boards to be mindful of what we are consuming: there's been a lot of suggestion in topics and within discussions that Obama is the AC, to which we respond psychically and psychologically. If it is of any consolation, I am 99.9% certain he is not.

But I do believe that this election should be watched carefully, and not taken strictly at face value. There is potential for great harmony or great strife. People need to be careful not to be baited into violence. We need to be careful not to be led to create a 'false' apocalypse. [I believe the true apocalypse has been occurring for millennia - mystical writings need to be understood in spiritual terms.]

We're being primed to react from a place of fear & distress. Look at Hollywood's recent focus on end-of-the-world scenarios. The media's focus on the same - global warming, global terrorism, UFOs & planet X appearing in mainstream news sources, etc. Something is up ... but not what it seems to be.

Nix I understand exactly what you are stating. However this dream came to me in early January before the mass hysteria started, or the organized religions started to correlate Obama to the Antichrist.

I do not believe that he is the Antichrist, but there is something about Obama that is not genuine. I have stayed away from this topic because it is so politically charged. I have not come to the conclusion that the Antichrist will even be one person. I have felt that it could possibly be a governmental entity. I won't go into why I feel that at this time. It would take more than a paragraph to explain.

I see Obama with a very dark aura. He is deceitful. Of course I am not endorsing any other candidate. They are all deceitful. There is an ominous feeling about this Presidential race unlike any I have ever had.

This is a gift I have that I cannot deny. That is one of being able to attune to the true character of one's soul and spirit, and the persona that Obama puts forth and his true spirit do not align. He has several faces.

The United States is in for some extreme changes, both politically and catastrophic earth and heavenly events. We will all be affected by these changes.

You are right about being primed to act out of fear and distress. I do believe that others are feeling and seeing the coming changes without understanding why, what they are, and that this cannot be stopped at this point. We have crossed the threshold. But fear and distress are the worst possible points to base our actions from.

I can see that Grandmother earth is heaving. She is distressed and we will undergo a purge. There is no way to avoid these changes now. They are unfolding before us everyday. We need to operate from a center of light, but even love will not change the hearts of many at this time. We have to focus in order not to be caught up in the violence, and it IS going to happen.

We will soon suffer a famine of such a magnitude as never before seen. We are going to see more violence on our shores. We are going to see civil unrest in the masses. We are going to see more calamities and catastrophic weather events that will send our economy even further into darkness. This is not a time for the faint of heart. We have to be aware in order to prepare. That is why we have free will, reasoning power and the gift of discernment. The signs before the storm are apparent and we must not be deceived and lulled into a sense of complacency and apathy.

It is so true that discernment is critical to 1. The Thinking Process, 2. The acting out of the thought process, and 3. The personal analysis of 1. and 2.

Unfortunately, most people do not take the time necessary to do this with discernment. Rather we find SOMEONE ELSE'S ANALYSIS (more often than not---our media) do it for us. Without knowing it, the forces we feel are "anti" this, "anti" that have won. Its what "they" want. We all speak about fear/end of times pitfalls we may fall into (if we consider scriptures' prophecies (of any religion) above all other considerations), BUT THE REAL DESIRE OF THE "ANTI" THIS, "ANTI" THAT CONTROLLING FORCES IS CONFUSION...... rather than fear....in my opinion....

Spring Miracles wrote:

Nix I understand exactly what you are stating. However this dream came to me in early January before the mass hysteria started, or the organized religions started to correlate Obama to the Antichrist ...

I see Obama with a very dark aura. He is deceitful. Of course I am not endorsing any other candidate. They are all deceitful. There is an ominous feeling about this Presidential race unlike any I have ever had.

This is a gift I have that I cannot deny. That is one of being able to attune to the true character of one's soul and spirit, and the persona that Obama puts forth and his true spirit do not align. He has several faces.

Hi Spring,
As one who dreams, I want you to know that I only present these points for your consideration. I understand what you are speaking of when you speak of clarity and lucidity, those definitely tend to be the dreams that hold the most significance over the long haul. And I also appreciate the timing of your dream in relation to this point at which we are discussing it.

So, I hope that my words do not come across as contradiction, only counterpoint. Personally, I believe nothing is certain, nothing is predetermined. But, certainly, it is important to read the skies when forecasting the weather.

Still, our responsibilities are the same (in my mind), and we can affect the outcome of events even if acting as small centers of calm during these storms. Or even better, to act as shining suns that disperse the storm clouds altogether. There are certainly many forces at work in our world, constructive and destructive, and we choose which we align ourselves with on a daily basis.

Vision is given to inform decision.
Love,

Wild Dove wrote:

It is so true that discernment is critical to 1. The Thinking Process, 2. The acting out of the thought process, and 3. The personal analysis of 1. and 2.

Unfortunately, most people do not take the time necessary to do this with discernment. Rather we find SOMEONE ELSE'S ANALYSIS (more often than not---our media) do it for us. Without knowing it, the forces we feel are "anti" this, "anti" that have won. Its what "they" want. We all speak about fear/end of times pitfalls we may fall into (if we consider scriptures' prophecies (of any religion) above all other considerations), BUT THE REAL DESIRE OF THE "ANTI" THIS, "ANTI" THAT CONTROLLING FORCES IS CONFUSION...... rather than fear....in my opinion....

Wild Dove you could not be more correct about the thinking process. Most people work from a sense of fear and confusion - as you state. This is not where we want to be. But we must keep our eyes and ears open, and our spirit pure. We must be able to see the signs and not be blinded. We must not be caught unaware. The elders, as well as Jesus from a spiritual perspective, have all taught that there will be a multitude of signs. There will be events that are solely for our discernment to prepare us for even more. We must choose which path we will follow. Either we go with the destructive or we choose to step off the familiar path (which sometimes feels too comfortable) and follow the light that will emerge from the darkness.

We will weather this storm. We will emerge whole and pure. But there are things that must come to purge the unhealthy and the wicked in spirit. This is path we must walk, and now there is no turning back. We have paved this road with our ignorance and apathy. We must not fear though. The fearful will not survive.

I have been shown that it is imperative to prepare. One must begin to help their self and their own before they will be able to help others through this time. To tune out and turn a blind eye to the myriad of signs is to dull the senses and lower the spirit. We do not want to be trapped in a dimension of despair. We must strive to rise and ascend.

As for the media that is something we need to tune out. We cannot base our facts upon the propaganda machine.

Wild Dove wrote:

Unfortunately, most people do not take the time necessary to do this with discernment. Rather we find SOMEONE ELSE'S ANALYSIS (more often than not---our media) do it for us. Without knowing it, the forces we feel are "anti" this, "anti" that have won. Its what "they" want. We all speak about fear/end of times pitfalls we may fall into (if we consider scriptures' prophecies (of any religion) above all other considerations), BUT THE REAL DESIRE OF THE "ANTI" THIS, "ANTI" THAT CONTROLLING FORCES IS CONFUSION...... rather than fear....in my opinion....

I believe this is true. It's the common denominator of every emotionally-charged issue; it's the double-sided aspect of every coin we flip. Many of us are mobilized not by what we are FOR, but by what we are AGAINST.

But if we transcend this illusion/reality of dualism, then we are left with nothing against to struggle, but instead a vision which to pursue. Yes? And when we have such a vision, there will be those who present themselves in opposition to us (to our vision) ... because that vision is perceived as a threat. But this vision includes them, we no longer perceive others to be the enemy, and this is what they do not understand.

Wow. I just had this urge to bump this today. Interesting conversation.

Not to get too far off subject, but ...

Much of our current crisis seems to be constructed, not natural. Particularly the economic and geopolitical aspects of our current situation. And media distorts our ability to judge the propensity of natural disasters, similarly to how it distorts our perceptions of safety. (For instance, 'local' news often reports heinous crimes from across the nation. One might respond to such reports, Wow, how horrible people have become. Or one may recognize, Wow, the media has to look 500 miles away from here to find a story heinous enough to make headlines).

I don't think that this is a matter of sticking one's head in the sand and denying what negative forces are at work around us, but recognition of the limit of their scope.

Am I really off point now?

'nixfan wrote:

Hi Spring,
As one who dreams, I want you to know that I only present these points for your consideration. I understand what you are speaking of when you speak of clarity and lucidity, those definitely tend to be the dreams that hold the most significance over the long haul. And I also appreciate the timing of your dream in relation to this point at which we are discussing it.

So, I hope that my words do not come across as contradiction, only counterpoint. Personally, I believe nothing is certain, nothing is predetermined. But, certainly, it is important to read the skies when forecasting the weather.

Still, our responsibilities are the same (in my mind), and we can affect the outcome of events even if acting as small centers of calm during these storms. Or even better, to act as shining suns that disperse the storm clouds altogether. There are certainly many forces at work in our world, constructive and destructive, and we choose which we align ourselves with on a daily basis.

Vision is given to inform decision.
Love,

I am not offended Nix. I appreciate any insight into any subject or topic I offer. My view is not necessarily what may be the view of another, and it may be in total opposition to what feels correct for you or anybody else. I offer my opinion for discernment and it is not set in stone.

I feel that there have been two paths laid before us. Not particularly a certainty, but two opposing paths. The majority in tune with negativity have chosen the path of destruction. Some of us have taken the more difficult path (and it certainly is MORE difficult) of ascension and truth. We had the option to choose and I have seen the fork in the road pass a long time ago. There is no turning back now, so yes I do believe that our destiny is one where there is no avoiding the purge that must take place.

Your analogy of being a small center of calm in the storm is one I completely agree with. There will be pockets of calm in the midst, but outside the pockets the winds of change will be ferocious. This will not be an easy time. So prepare we must.

Quote :

I believe this is true. It's the common denominator of every emotionally-charged issue; it's the double-sided aspect of every coin we flip. Many of us are mobilized not by what we are FOR, but by what we are AGAINST.

But if we transcend this illusion/reality of dualism, then we are left with nothing against to struggle, but instead a vision which to pursue.

I agree. I could talk about Rushdie's Satanic Verses and the events surrounding its publication, I could also talk about Tony Bushby's "The Bible Fraud and "Secrets of the Bible", but I won't (although I found many of my own "truths" in both of them). Both authors have had to go underground for fear of assassination. One writes a "novel" (about islamic "lies or truths") and the other about biblical "lies or truths".

No one even knows where the word Christ or christian comes from. They certainly are not aramaic, greek or hebrew. No one disagrees with that. Some say it (Christians-Khrestians) came from the name Judas Khrestus, said to be Jesus' twin brother, who had his own following, rebelling against then current religious authority). All scriptures are debatable, particularly the christian ones, since Bushby's book, the Vatican has literally made it impossible for ANYONE to re-examine the original canons (which they still claim to have under lock and key). This "anti-christ" thing becomes oxymoronic when we don't even know who/what it represents.

I am neither for or against biblical teachings, other than I believe corruption, manipulation and self-promoting interests are AT THE HEART of ALL religions. Here I wish to tell you MY dream about "The Christ/anti-christ "thing":

After subduing my "Chimera/monster", I climb these steps into the sky and am met by nine beings clothed in white robes. One comes forward and plunges a sword into my heart and I die, am transformed into a being flying over a cliff, grab onto the top of a huge pine tree that bends over (like a huge gust of wind had plummeted it over to the ground), and I am deposited onto the floor of the canyon over which I was flung. I awoke feeling a powerful "release" that is still with me today. The words from the robed being who plunged the sword into my heart were: "Like a thousand christs, here is your reward!".

Echoing from my mouth when I awoke was the scream GNOSIS. I had to look up the word (which at first I thought was GENESIS, then immediately knew it was GNOSIS) which means "hidden knowledge".

You see, however one interprets the dream, one's own personal take is more important than any other interest (whether universal, or self-aggrandizing). It is the same with Visions. One needs to share it and like Rumi said in one of his poems, "Now that you have read my words, please do not take them home with you. Leave them where you found them. They live at a different address than you do.......need I say more?

Spring Miracles wrote:

This will not be an easy time. So prepare we must.

When was it easy? HA!HA!HA! You are right, there are two paths ... may we all choose wisely. Thanks, 'nix

Quote :

Still, our responsibilities are the same (in my mind), and we can affect the outcome of events even if acting as small centers of calm during these storms. Or even better, to act as shining suns that disperse the storm clouds altogether. There are certainly many forces at work in our world, constructive and destructive, and we choose which we align ourselves with on a daily basis.

Again, 'nixfan, you hit it on the head. Particularly ON A DAILY BASIS!!!!

Repetition is powerful. When I was in Morocco, I asked a dear friend, Saide, what his name meant. He said it meant sadness of the heart. Imagine the cruelty of being called by one's ownmother, father, friends, etc., "sadness of the heart" day after day, after day? He really was a very sad young man when I met him......

Quote :

(For instance, 'local' news often reports heinous crimes from across the nation. One might respond to such reports, Wow, how horrible people have become. Or one may recognize, Wow, the media has to look 500 miles away from here to find a story heinous enough to make headlines).

I don't think that this is a matter of sticking one's head in the sand and denying what negative forces are at work around us, but recognition of the limit of their scope.

I am reminded of one of my favorite CD's, Robert Mirabal's "Music from a Painted Cave" and his song that hauntingly sings, "Skin-walker's moon, just let it rise!" Though he was speaking about how the euro-amero white folk have distorted his culture and nearly broken their spirit, there was peace and celebration "hidden" in his sad songs.

We must focus on the feelings we OURSELVES have every time we either post/comment/read from respected sources, and of course deal with the daily news. Its always in the "hidden celestial chorus" one can hear in the "painted cave" of our own hearts and minds.....Here is one of my poems about the "hidden choir":

Wild Dove wrote:

You see, however one interprets the dream, one's own personal take is more important than any other interest (whether universal, or self-aggrandizing). It is the same with Visions. One needs to share it and like Rumi said in one of his poems, "Now that you have read my words, please do not take them home with you. Leave them where you found them. They live at a different address than you do.......need I say more?

This is so true Wild Dove. I could not have put it more eloquently, of which I tried in my earlier post. What is true for me may not be true for another. We should follow our heart and what our soul and spirit tell us, but we must never impose this path on another. Our karma, our energy and our spirit takes us all on different paths. Our interpretations must come from a distinct reasoning and some of us will have visions and dreams others cannot comprehend.

In following Nix' post of the media distortion I have another perspective on it altogether, and that is because of my personal experience.

I worked in DC years ago and found nothing to be true coming from the media. Not even close. There is too much secrecy. I feel that if the media were to expound on certain issues the tides would appear even more fierce. There is an occultish force in DC. and a vortex of misinformation.

I also found with my experience during Katrina that the focus was entirely upon one certain segment of society (granted - there was extreme suffering) but because the media was transfixed on this phenomenon they failed to see the entire picture. Actually areas away from New Orleans suffered worst fates. I know the town I resided in was completely destroyed. Not one person escaped some kind of destruction. When I was allowed back in by the National Guard I saw bodies floating in the water and hitting up against the piers. Death and despair were everywhere. Even in my house where there were dead animals in every nook and cranny. This was not reported or publicized to any extent. I remember sitting in a hotel room before I returned watching the news and I was under the impression that we had somehow escaped the brunt of the destruction. I could not have been more wrong.

So to say a lot of it is contrived is true to a point, but contrived to leave out aspects of great importance for us to form reasonable opinions. It is greatly biased coming from all bases.

This is what I am trying to convey, and that is that my experience has given me an entirely different viewpoint from what another may see. It is the direction I have been given and the from what I have to build upon and go forth with what is logical for me.

Not that any other viewpoint is wrong - it is just not mine. My eyes have seen things that others haven't, my psyche has experienced burdens and events that others haven't and vice versa.

So I will skip off into my rabbit hole and capture my fireflies to light my way.

Quote :

"Because the spirit world is so misunderstood, it brings to mind the old Indian adage of six blind men describing an elephant. One feels the animals tail and reports that he is like a serpent. Another feels his side and declares that he is like a wide, strong tree. The third man, standing near his trunk, says the animal is thick and rope-like. And the story goes on. In other words, every person that reports of spiritual encounters is only bringing back part of the story"

YOU BETTER NOT, YOU BIG BEAUTIFUL HARE. YOU WILL ALWAYS BE TOPS IN MY HAREM (fox in me speaking)!!!!! You can't hide from me!

I knew you had been through hell, but not knowing the extent of which I now know, I only respect you even that much more. THAT YOU STILL (even though you dance between the two) HAVE FAITH, HOPE AND A DESIRE TO BE OF HELP TO OTHERS IS DAMN REMARKABLE, GIRL!

I too have had tragedy, maybe even more personal than yours, but in these times "more than" or "worse than" must be dropped. In fact, Grandmother told me to tell my people one day to try to spend at least twenty-four hours speaking without adjective, period!!! ("Isn't that cruel person over there disgusting", or "Isn't that beautiful person over there wonderful?" to simply "Look at that person over there.", for example.)

I tried it and found it almost impossible to do, realizing just how many of my observations had negative adjectives attached to them. The friends at the fire circle (it was a first harvest pagan festival usually held on August 1 each year) also were stunned by the counsel Grandmother presented. We must rid ourselves of adjectives that compare things (particularly people) all the time, if we are to really become a community that must learn how to survive our disasters together.....You never cease to amaze me, dear sister. Wa do for being you!!!!!

Wild Dove wrote:

I too have had tragedy, maybe even more personal than yours, but in these times "more than" or "worse than" must be dropped. In fact, Grandmother told me to tell my people one day to try to spend at least twenty-four hours speaking without adjective, period!!! ("Isn't that cruel person over there disgusting", or "Isn't that beautiful person over there wonderful?" to simply "Look at that person over there.", for example.)

I tried it and found it almost impossible to do, realizing just how many of my observations had negative adjectives attached to them. The friends at the fire circle (it was a first harvest pagan festival usually held on August 1 each year) also were stunned by the counsel Grandmother presented. We must rid ourselves of adjectives that compare things (particularly people) all the time, if we are to really become a community that must learn how to survive our disasters together.....You never cease to amaze me, dear sister. Wa do for being you!!!!!

Wild Dove I know - I have been shown that you have suffered immensely. That is one of the reasons you have grown so in spirit and soul. That is a major influence for your understanding and for your all encompassing compassion.

You are correct again in that there is no comparison in suffering. There is no such thing as worse or more. We have all been affected somehow. During my years of chemo (on and off again) I have seen children who touched me deeply. Who in all their innocence never complained. I never felt sorry for myself after seeing these children smile with their little bald heads and swollen bodies. Some survived and others passed this earthly test to be taken to another place in time for another purpose.

We do not know what others have endured. We cannot imagine the broken spirits or comprehend the reasons why some have become earthbound and others have soared. It is a mystery to us unless our eyes are meant to be opened to this.